Info-Atari16 Digest Mon, 11 Nov 91 Volume 91 : Issue 590 Today's Topics: *** FOR SALE *** montior and printer Bash 1.10 for MiNT 0.9 Data Diet type programs & Random access (2 msgs) GNU UTILITIES POSTED TO ATARI.ARCHIVE Is It Kosher? Latest version of gulam MiNT 0.9 is now available New RCC Rules = Higher Telecomm Costs Panther & Jaguar. sold Stacy Uploading to the VAX...I can't do it?! Video Toaster WordPerfect 2.x for the Mac (via Spectre) (2 msgs) Welcome to the Info-Atari16 Digest. The configuration for the automatic cross-posting to/from Usenet is getting closer, but still getting thrashed out. Please send notifications about broken digests or bogus messages to Info-Atari16-Request@NAUCSE.CSE.NAU.EDU. Please send requests for un/subscription and other administrivia to Info-Atari16-Request, *NOT* Info-Atari16. Requests that go to the list instead of the moderators are likely to be lost or ignored. If you want to unsubscribe, and you're receiving the digest indirectly from someplace (usually a BITNET host) that redistributes it, please contact the redistributor, not us. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 11 Nov 91 18:59:49 GMT From: psinntp!ultb!ultb!drp9500@uunet.uu.net (D.R. Paradis ) Subject: *** FOR SALE *** montior and printer To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu I have a SC1224 monitor manufactured Nov 85' (I believe those are the JVC ones) It's one of the good ones!! Works great! No problems! asking $250 obo The printer is a Panasonic KX-P1091i. Still on it's original ribbon. 192cps. 2 NLQ modes. 100% working condition, never had a single problem! asking $150 obo Notice I said "asking price", fell free to email offers if you don't like the price. Shipping for each of these is probably going to run about $10 (i'm guessing). Bob -- ************************************************************************ * Just because I'm a film major | < Net-address > * * doesn't mean I'm a Spielber-wanna-be....| * * I'm a Lynch-wanna-be! | drp9500@ultb.isc.rit.edu * ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 13:07:11 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!gatech!uflorida!travis!jgj@arizona.edu (Jeff Jackson) Subject: Bash 1.10 for MiNT 0.9 To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu Is this a separate port of it from scott's? I certainly use it without running MiNT. -- ============================================================================ Jeffrey Glen Jackson _|_Satan jeered, "You're dead meat Jesus, I'm gonna jgj@ssd.csd.harris.com | bust you up tonight." x5120 | Jesus said, "Go ahead, make my day." %%%%%%%%% -- Carman, "The Champion" ------------------------------ Date: 3 Nov 91 23:41:16 GMT From: psinntp!uupsi!tfd!afp!gna!linn!Marco.Fris@uunet.uu.net (Marco Fris) Subject: Data Diet type programs & Random access To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu > How [well] does it cope with random accesses to a file? For example, > if I Fseek 15000 bytes into the file, how does D.D. cope? I'm lost, > and very sceptical about these Data Diet tools. As DD's readme states, it extracts a full copy of the file into it's working directory. So your program sees exactly the same file as it would without the DD stuff, albeit not on the same physical place. > crash on my hard disk, but I was able to restore a large number of > ASCII source files by dumping tracks from the HD and manually sorting > them out. Had they been compressed, all would have been lost. If you didn't have a backup, that is. But you, being an able minded computer user, have a nice and fresh one of course... - Marco - --- And now ... number one ... The Larch. Marco.Fris@p11.f202.n281.z2.fidonet.org or Marco.Fris@p11.f202.n281.z2.linn.gna.tfd.com ------------------------------ Date: 3 Nov 91 23:53:26 GMT From: psinntp!uupsi!tfd!afp!gna!linn!Marco.Fris@uunet.uu.net (Marco Fris) Subject: Data Diet type programs & Random access To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu > 1. Should the Atari Megafile 30 make a "chirping, or beeping, or > squeking, or creaking" kind of sound when it writes to the drive? > The sound is kind of hard to describe! :=( The drive made this sound > from the beginning, and it worries me now as much as it did then. > There has to be someone else who owns a MegaFile or has heard the sound > before... It does make some noise during acesses. It's kinda hard to compare what I hear to what you described, but why don't you go listen to one in a shop? Seems to me that if this sound ment something bad, you would have found out in these months. > My last question has to do with power surges. Today my hard drive > was running fine and then it suddenly started running FAST! The fan > started whirring *REAL* fast, and I turned it off right away. Could > this have been a power surge? It has never happened before, and my > power bar claims to have a surge supressor (but not eliminator?). No, that's no power surge. These are very short, the only thing you'd probably notice when a power surge hits your machine is the smoke coming out of it... You might have a problem with the internal power supply of the M30. - Marco - --- And now ... number one ... The Larch. Marco.Fris@p11.f202.n281.z2.fidonet.org or Marco.Fris@p11.f202.n281.z2.linn.gna.tfd.com ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 16:34:01 GMT From: noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!gatech!uflorida!travis!jgj@arizona.edu (Jeff Jackson) Subject: GNU UTILITIES POSTED TO ATARI.ARCHIVE To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu I have just posted the binaries to the GNU Utilities to atari.archive. They should show up there before long. Man pages and sources will be sent later this week or next week. The following is the readme file that accompanies them: ################################################################ This is my port of various gnu utilities. They are intended for use under bash1.10, also available on atari.archive.umich.edu. Together, these give you a rather complete Un*x environment based on gnu software. The following zoo archives are available. These also include some non-GNU public domain software. executables source manual_pages ------------------------------------- file31b file31s file31m shell13b shell13s shell13m text11b text11s text11m misc1b misc1s misc1m README What do you need to set yourself up? First, you need bash. I keep everything on disk D: under a directory called gnu. The following is my directory setup: gnu bin gxxinc include lib man etc Until you have a good feel for how everything works together, I recommend you use it. Put bash.ttp in \gnu\bin. Now you need to know about UNIXMODE. The gnu libraries emulate unix style filenames and symbolic links. If a filename consists of all digits and lowercase letters and has no more than 8 characters plus 3 character extender, it maps directly to a TOS filename. Otherwise, a name TOS file is made up from the real name and an entry in a file called ".dir" is maintained to describe the mapping. Symbolic links are also recorded in the same filey. This feature is controlled via the UNIXMODE environment variable. It is a string of characters for customizing UNIXMODE operation. By default, bash will set it to "/.,rCLAHdb". These characters mean: "/" permit "/" as well as "\" to separate path elements ".," map extra periods to "," when deriving TOS names. "rC" make root file system be drive C. "L" permit symbolic links "A" permit unix style filenames "H" hide the .dir file from directory searches "d" provide psuedo device directory /dev/X is file system x: /dev/console is CON: /dev/tty1 is AUX: /dev/lp is PRN: "b" open files in binary mode The only ones you would every probably want to modify are "rC" to select another file system as root and "d" if you use MiNT. MiNT users will probably want to use the string "/.,rULAHb". Note that this must be setup before you run bash. I've included in the readme archive a program for setting desktop's environment variables that a stole from a TeX distribution. Note that programs compiled with the MiNT libraries do not know about UNIXMODE. hence you must use command lines like $ bg -o d:\\nohup\\output command string when using MiNT utilities. You will want to put all the binary archives (*b.zoo) in /gnu/bin and than manual pages ones (*m.zoo) in /gnu/man. Now, what all do you get? The following lists the commands from each utility package with notes on some of them. Some individual tools are not ported since their functionality is not available under TOS or UNIXMODE. ***** README ****** copying -- the GNU communist manifesto copying.lib -- the GNU communist manifesto for libraries env.inf -- see setenv.prg passwd -- sample /etc/passwd (Yes it is usefull. Files pretend to be owned by user 1. Make an entry for yourself to make ls -l and some other commands look nice. profile -- sample /etc/profile. When you start up bash, give it the -login parameter. readme -- this file setenv.prg -- program for setting environment variables from desktop. I've never used it. I don't have source. Don't tell me about problems with it. Uses env.inf. termcap --/etc/termcap used by emacs and some other programs. ****** SHELL UTILITIES 1.3 ******* basename date dirname env expr groups -- not ported id logname nice -- not ported. See MiNT utilities nohup -- not ported. See "bg" in MiNT utilities pathchk -- /dev is not fully emulated as a directory printenv printf sleep stty -- not ported. See MiNT utilities tee test -- testing /dev/X always succeeds, even if filesystem not mounted. tty -- not ported whoami uname -- not ported yes ***** FILE UTILITIES 3.1 ****** chgrp -- not ported. chmod -- can only modify the user write bit. cp dd df -- doesn't recognize /dev/A or /dev/B dir du install ln ls mkdir mkfifo -- not ported. mknod -- not ported. mv rm rmdir touch vdir ***** TEXT UTILITIES 1.1 ***** cat cmp comm csplit cut expand fold head join paste pr sort split sum tac tail unexpand uniq wc ***** MISC UTILITIES 1 ***** Several of these were already ported, but I wanted them built with the latest and greatest libraries since a number of fixes have been done, so I did a new quick and dirty port. Include also are some non-GNU software. These will receive lower priority as far as sustaining goes. Send me bug reports anyway. combine -- best file comparer in the world. Humans can actually combine2 -- read the output of these and they are great for three -- way compares when doing merges. diff diff3 -- not ported. egrep find fgrep grep locate -- not ported patch sed xargs which -- I wrote this one a long time ago. mkid -- software package for maintaining database of words from text lid -- or software soruces. We live and swear by it at Harris. idx fid gid -- symbolic link to lid.ttp aid -- ditto eid -- ditto pid -- ditto iid ################### Let me know of any bugs you find. Fixes to them are also appreciated. These need to be built with at least patchlevel 74 libraries (Which are not yet (November 10, 1991) available for general consumption). -- ============================================================================ Jeffrey Glen Jackson _|_Satan jeered, "You're dead meat Jesus, I'm gonna jgj@ssd.csd.harris.com | bust you up tonight." x5120 | Jesus said, "Go ahead, make my day." %%%%%%%%% -- Carman, "The Champion" ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 12:01:13 GMT From: stanford.edu!msi.umn.edu!umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!lapis.labmed.umn.edu!davidli@ames.a rpa Subject: Is It Kosher? To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <9831@cactus.org>, covert@cactus.org (Richard Covert) writes: > I was hoping that some kind soul would start posting the > newer fonts for page stream 2.1 that are on GEnie. > > I can go broke real fast d/ling all of the PgS 2.1 > fonts now on GEnie. What gall! Why should someone else go to the trouble of obtaining all of the fonts you want from GEnie (at -their- cost) just so you can save yourself money? By the way, Richard, why do you need the Pagestream fonts at all? I would think that, given your attitude toward Atari ST equipment, you'd have purchased a Macintosh by now, and could then go bother the Macintosh forums for Adobe fonts... -- David Paschall-Zimbel davidli@simvax.labmed.umn.edu "I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I go into the other room and read a book." -- Groucho Marx 1890-1977 ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 08:46:56 GMT From: mcsun!hp4nl!alchemy!ruunfs!ruunfs!muts@uunet.uu.net (Peter Mutsaers) Subject: Latest version of gulam To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu Sorry of this is a FAQ, but: I have a beta version of gulam, from early '88. Lately I picked up the version from atari.archive, but it was even older. As my version is beta, I guess there must be a newer and more definitive version. Could anyone tell where and if? Thanks in advance, -- _________________________________________________________________________ Peter Mutsaers. RUU physics dept. Heidelberglaan 5, Utrecht, Nederland muts@fysap.fys.ruu.nl |================================================ tel: (+31)-(0)30-533880 | " Trust me; I know what I'm doing. " ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 16:04:55 GMT From: noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!news-server.ecf!helios.physics.utoronto.ca!juli an!uwovax.uwo.ca!7103_2622@arizona.edu (Eric Smith) Subject: MiNT 0.9 is now available To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article , gjh@hplb.hpl.hp.com (Graham Higgins) writes: > >> Has anyone else had trouble with the MiNT port of KSH unter MiNT 0.9? > > Yes, I have experienced the same problems. > >> and if ggascoigne (sp?) intends to upgrade KSH or release his source >> code. > > ggascoigne (sp correct) does intend to upgrade ksh, as soon as he gets his > hands on Mint v09 and the libs. I have offered to supply both locally (U.K.). My apologies to everyone for breaking ksh. I *believe* that the problem is that "close(0); dup(n);" used to be the same as "dup2(n, 0)" in MiNT 0.8, but doesn't work in MiNT 0.9. If this is indeed the problem (I haven't yet obtained ksh to try this) then it will be fixed in the forthcoming MiNT 0.91 (which will also have a kludge in it to allow sozobon and other dLibs compiled programs to work). (If the above conjecture is incorrect, please let me know ASAP!) -- Eric R. Smith email: Dept. of Mathematics eric.smith@uwo.ca University of Western Ontario 7103_2622@uwovax.bitnet ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 17:57:46 GMT From: ucla-se!pantheon!willing@locus.ucla.edu (Scott Willingham) Subject: New RCC Rules = Higher Telecomm Costs To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <1991Nov11.051410.25757@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu> wmagro@roma.uiuc.edu (William Magro) writes: > >Aren't under-regulated monopolies lovely? Michigan Bell, like Illinois Bell, is owned >by Ameritech. Illinois Bell did the per call charge first in Chicago. Now it is >implemented all over Illinois. My local charges have basically doubled. Unlimited >local calls used to be $5.50/mo. The charges are $0.062 per call (untimed) for >calls during the day. This drops to $0.03 per call at night. It sucks. They have >the nerve to print: "Volume discount saved you $0.22 this month\n" on my bill.... > >Bill And you have the nerve to criticise the various Bells for being self-serving while at the same time advocating that those of us who make a few calls a month should subsidize your unlimited calls by paying a flat rate. -- Scott . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ------------------------------ Date: 2 Nov 91 17:04:10 GMT From: psinntp!uupsi!tfd!afp!gna!linn!Diederik.Hoogenboom@uunet.uu.net (Diederik Hoogenboom) Subject: Panther & Jaguar. To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In a message of <22 Oct 91 19:38:35>, strachan6183@mtroyal.uucp (2:320/100.1) writes: >> Someone mentioned two machines Atari is/was (rumored?) to be >> working on called Panther and Jaguar. Does anyone know what >> they are or where rumored to be? s> The Panther is supposed to be the next St and the Jaguar is just an s> atari console similar to the megadrive or the super famicom Atari cancled the Panther-project due to the fast development of the Jaguar and its technical extensions (32 bit, lotsa colors, ect.). The Jaguar is supposed to be a lot better than the Megadrive or Super Famicom. Sega will also release a new console soon, called Gigadrive (how orginal). Greetz... %Diederik% --- STabloid Development, Point At %ABC% On Diederik.Hoogenboom@p9.f801.n281.z2.fidonet.org or Diederik.Hoogenboom@p9.f801.n281.z2.linn.gna.tfd.com ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 19:19:51 GMT From: SERVER.CS.JHU.EDU!niko@ucbvax.berkeley.edu Subject: sold To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu Yesterday,I posted a message in which I put my REPLAY 8 and MultiGEM for sale. Since I already received many replies for both items I consider them SOLD. Please do not send me any more messages for the above items. Thank you. ______________________________________________ V. Nikolaidis ________________ ______ | / __ \ Wave Arts ______ | niko@syzygy.cs.jhu.edu / /_/ /\ _____ _______ / ___/\ | nikolaid@radical-boy.cs.jhu.edu / __ / / / __/\ /_ __/\ \ \__\/ | vasilis@JHUVMS.BITNET / / / / / / / _\/ \/ / _\/__\ \ | /__/ /__/ / /__/ / /__/ / /_____/\ | ...another broke Atari ST \__\/\__\/ \__\/ \__\/ \_____\/ | and Amiga enthusiast. Custom-made Sailboards | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 11:55:34 GMT From: stanford.edu!msi.umn.edu!umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!lapis.labmed.umn.edu!davidli@ames.a rpa Subject: Stacy To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <9829@cactus.org>, covert@cactus.org (Richard Covert) writes: > ...that same $2400 that you spent last year on your STacy will now buy you... There is a problem with this kind of thinking. Of -course- the computer you bought a year and a half ago isn't as great as the 'newest' thing on the market. And it probably cost as much, or more, than what you could purchase today. However, if you had a -current- need for a computer, waiting for a 'possibly' better (non-existent) computer for the better part of a year or so is criminally stupid. -- David Paschall-Zimbel davidli@simvax.labmed.umn.edu "I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I go into the other room and read a book." -- Groucho Marx 1890-1977 ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 17:38:24 GMT From: noao!asuvax!cs.utexas.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs .ohio-state.edu!jabberwock.shs.ohio-state.edu!sun1.is.battelle.org!bclcl1.im.ba ttelle.org!ohstpy!miavx1! Subject: Uploading to the VAX...I can't do it?! To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu I have this ZMODEM program that lets me upload/download files on the VAX. But it sucks...it *never* works on my binary files. There's also an XOMDEM utility on our VAX, but it creates this XMODEM.LOG file that gets to be hundreds of blocks long which uses up too much disk space...exceeds my quota, and then an hour long download aborts with just a few thousand bytes left. I'm peeved. (and that's putting it mildly!) Can anyone please tell me a nice simple way to transfer files from my Atari 1040 ST with a Supra 2400 modem to the stupid Univ of Dayton VAX? --Dennis (Cogito cogito, ergo cogito sum.) ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 16:53:08 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!wupost!udel!brahms.udel.edu! don@arizona.edu (Donald R Lloyd) Subject: Video Toaster To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article mc4c+@andrew.cmu.edu (Mark Choi) writes: >First, let me preface this by saying that I actually like the Amiga, it >is just some of it's more pious followers that I can not stand. > Ditto here, but fill in (Amiga, PC, Mac, ST, ) in place of "Amiga" above 8). [stuff deleted] > It is now official. Newtek has announced realease of the PC MS-DOS >version of the Video Toaster, for IBM PC's and compatibles. Can an ST Yes, there is also a Mac version. Interesting thing about these Toasters is that, unlike the Amiga version, they're not on a plug-in card; instead, they're an external peripheral. Interesting thing about this peripheral is that it looks suspiciously like an Amiga 2000 with a Toaster logo covering the Amiga one.... Yep, the PC and Mac Toasters are actually full Amiga systems with DOS or Mac software to send ARexx (an Amiga interprocess communications language) commands from the Mac/PC to the Toaster software running on the Amiga. >version be all that far behind? Or a mac version, for that matter? Once >that arrives, along with the Lexicor software, and a 24 bit board, it >would make one damn cheap video system, even cheaper than the Amiga. And I doubt an ST version of the toaster, even in it's 'peripheral' form, will ever show up. Two main reasons: 1) The Toaster hardware is tightly coupled to the Amiga architecture, and the software is written almost entirely in assembly. It took NewTek years to design the Toaster for a machine that already had NTSC output; it's probably just not worth it for them to build a board for any other system when they can sell their 'peripherals' just as easily without having to worry about converting scan rates, etc. 2) The Toaster is an NTSC machine with no PAL version planned, according to NewTek. This leaves out the European market, where most STs are. I just don't think there are enough STs in use in the US any more to justify Newtek aiming for them. On the other hand, there's absolutely no reason why some ST hacker can't come up with a way to send ARexx messages to the peripheral version, but all it would be is a front-end to the Toaster to keep the user 'safe' from the Amiga side. Oh, and why a separate 24-bit board? The Toaster's already got two 32-bit frame buffers (granted, they're very _slow_ frame buffers, but they're there...) >when MTOS comes out, the last claim to fame of the AMI-OS, assuming that >MTOS is what it is claimed to be, will be gone as well. All this relies >a bit oin speculation about the Atari side, but even still, it is nice >sometimes to burst the bubble of the overly pious by reminding them that >the rest of the world moves on. > Hmm... nah, I'll leave this one alone... :-) >All hail the guru, and the interlace video headache. Neither are a problem on my 3000 :-). No, before I get a dozen of the standard replies, I'm not some Amiga user who skims through ST newsgroups looking for openings to flame the ST or its users... I do occasionally skim through c.s.a.st out of genuine interest in the machine as an alternative to MS-DOS and to donations to Apple's legal department. This time I just happened to come across something I felt an urge to reply to :-). ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 13:09:27 GMT From: munnari.oz.au!metro!grivel!loki!skershaw@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu (Shane Kershaw) Subject: WordPerfect 2.x for the Mac (via Spectre) To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu From article <1991Nov10.181431.13190@rodan.acs.syr.edu>, by ggreenbe@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Gerald Greenberg): [stuff about wordperfect 2.0.1, 2.0.2, 2.0.3 for the Mac running under Spectre deleted] That's nice Gerry ;~) ;~). I'm currently using WP 4.0 written specifically for the ST and have not, so far ;~), experienced any problems with it. Its educational price here in Aus is AU$119. Performance for money is quite good. It was worth it just to be able to import and export IBM/IBM compatible files effectively (no dross in the files, just good clean ASCII). Shane. -- | "Life! Don't talk to me about life!" Douglas Adams via Marvin | | Shane Kershaw Internet: skershaw@loki.une.edu.au | \ University of NewEngland, Northern Rivers, Lismore NSW Australia / ====================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: 11 Nov 91 14:44:12 GMT From: psinntp!rodan.acs.syr.edu!ggreenbe@uunet.uu.net (Gerald Greenberg) Subject: WordPerfect 2.x for the Mac (via Spectre) To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <1970@loki.une.oz.au> skershaw@loki.une.oz.au (Shane Kershaw) writes: >From article <1991Nov10.181431.13190@rodan.acs.syr.edu>, by ggreenbe@rodan.acs.syr.edu (Gerald Greenberg): > > [stuff about wordperfect 2.0.1, 2.0.2, 2.0.3 > for the Mac running under Spectre deleted] >That's nice Gerry ;~) ;~). >I'm currently using WP 4.0 written specifically for the ST and have not, so far >;~), experienced any problems with it. >Its educational price here in Aus is AU$119. Performance for money is quite >good. It was worth it just to be able to import and export IBM/IBM compatible >files effectively (no dross in the files, just good clean ASCII). >Shane. Believe me, I'd love to be able to use the ST version of WP...but until I can use non-standard fonts, it it not all that useful. --Gerry ggreenbe@rodan.acs.syr.edu ------------------------------ End of Info-Atari16 Digest ******************************