Info-Atari16 Digest Tue, 25 Jun 91 Volume 91 : Issue 353 Today's Topics: .MOD files, DC Software, and the Amiga war. Another Atari write-in campaign... Atari-to-Amiga Convert Info Source! (4 msgs) Beginner's Guide to setting up GCC. Hard Disks lharc woes lharc woes (AGAIN, was Is musedt.lzh corrupted?) monitor woes Please, no Amiga "discussions" here Problems with Ghostscript ST and Multisync Thomas Quester, where are you? Whoops! Welcome to the Info-Atari16 Digest. The configuration for the automatic cross-posting to/from Usenet is getting closer, but still getting thrashed out. Please send notifications about broken digests or bogus messages to Info-Atari16-Request@NAUCSE.CSE.NAU.EDU. Please send requests for un/subscription and other administrivia to Info-Atari16-Request, *NOT* Info-Atari16. Requests that go to the list instead of the moderators are likely to be lost or ignored. If you want to unsubscribe, and you're receiving the digest indirectly from someplace (usually a BITNET host) that redistributes it, please contact the redistributor, not us. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 25 Jun 91 19:40:37 CDT From: Mike Dorman Subject: .MOD files, DC Software, and the Amiga war. To: Atari List >loaded from a floppy drive, and doesn't allow the hard drive boot >program to load. (It is a boot disk) The Digi-Composer gave a little Have you tried Double-CLick's DCBOOTIT? It says that it'll (usually) fool a boot disk into thinking that it's been auto booted--which sounds like that's just what you need. BTW, I'll throw my vote with ++jrb--I'd like to see some source, too. Some of the programs have had potential to make my life easier, but just won't *quite* integrate smoothly with my setup. If you can't/won't do this (which I would sort of understand, I'd just be mildly disappointed) I hereby request a revision of the program that allows you to turn floppies on/off and set their step rates--I'd love an auto program which would read a configuration and set it (like to automatically set my 5.25" B drive for 6ms) seamlessly, with no intervention--or at least a version that I could set as my GEM auto boot prg, and not notice when it executes, sets the stuff, and then exits. I don't want to have to do this stuff manually. (I know, I know, it's a simple prog to write, but I'm too lazy :~) Oh, yeah, stop the amiga flame war: specifically to Tom Hill--you have released your information, please let people come to you, because as long as you continue to post, people willcontinue to flame, and that's too much to wade through at 1200 baud. I, too like the amiga, mostly, though there'r some things about the OS that bother me--but I'll seek you out if I decide to switch. In the meantime, please wait somewhere else--your unfortuate remarks are making it hard for me to get any info for the ST I have *now*. THanks, all. :~) Mike ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- : Michael Alan Dorman : : : MDORMAN1@UA1VM.UA.EDU : Hobbies are things people do when they should be : : BIX: syssupport : sleeping. --M.A.D. : : GEnie: M.DORMAN2 : : : PostalNet: : : : Box 8068 : Stonehenge was built by two drunks with no : : Tuscaloosa, AL : witnesses. --P.S.McGhee : : 35486 : : ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 12:57:56 GMT From: pa.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!ryn.mro4.dec.com!aqua.enet.dec.com!rost@decwrl.dec .com (My name is Brian Rost) Subject: Another Atari write-in campaign... To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <91175.115025ONM07@DMSWWU1A.BITNET>, ONM07@DMSWWU1A.BITNET writes... >Please don't blame the `germans'. WP is mainly an american company, and >if they can't succeed in the U.S., they won't in Germany either. > >BTW: I would *love* to see a new WP on GEM! >___________________________ cut here _____________________________________ >Julian F. Reschke, Hensenstr. 142, D-4400 Muenster, Phone: ++49 251 861241 >fast eMail: ONM07@DMSWWU1A.BITNET, slow: jr@ms.maus.de (++49 251 77216) >____________________ correct me if I'm wrong _____________________________ Julian, WordPerfect is doing fine in the US, just not on ST platforms! It's a real hot seller in V5.0 for the IBM. I guess the developers don't see enough $$$ in doing an ST version, and that's that. If this keeps up, pretty soon, I'm going to have to write all my own application software 8;( Brian Rost @rgb.dec.com 508-568-6115 **************************************************** * * * The above does not reflect the opinions of * * my employer. * * * * If music is outlawed, only outlaws will be * * musicians. * * * **************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 01:54:18 GMT From: mcsun!ukc!slxsys!ibmpcug!mantis!mwowm!mathew@uunet.uu.net (Million Headed Monster) Subject: Atari-to-Amiga Convert Info Source! To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu What's an Amiga? mathew -- << baby mother hospital scissors creature judgement butcher engineer >> ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 21:06:55 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!caen!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!cunixf.cc.col umbia.edu!cunixb.cc.columbia.edu!es1@arizona.edu (Ethan Solomita) Subject: Atari-To-Amiga Convert Info Source! To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <1991Jun25.173313.27320@colorado.edu> chuj@horton.Colorado.EDU (CHU JEFFREY) writes: >In article <1991Jun24.222634.30979@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> es1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) writes: >> The first point you make isn't a computer war, but a chip >>war. The 040 is faster than the 486 at the same clock speed, > >I am trying to avoid any kind of war, this comp.sys.atari.st news is >not for these types of postings. SOOOO after this posting please >send all responses to the posting to me and not post it here. > I think that a discussion of chip technology is wholly relevant to this newsgroup, as long as Motorola 680x0 chips are a main part of the discussion. I shouldn't use the term war, I consider this to be a "discussion". >>(except under MS-DOS), but it is still close. The 040 25MHz does >>appr. 18-22 MIPS depending on who you believe (I know how >>meaningless that is, but we are talking all CISC chips, not RISC, >>so isn't a terrible statistic). I believe the 486 is about 12. > >MFLOPS is a better measure than MIPS, the 68040 25 does about 3.5 MFLOPS, >the i486-25 with Weitek 4167 does 10+ MFLOPS and the ranges of MIPS for >the 486-25 is from 11 to 15 MIPS. > I don't have MFLOPS statistics myself, so I'll take your for truth. You mention a Weitek math coprocessor, which is not made by Intel. That is something separate which is an additional cost beyond the 486. Also, MFLOPS stands for "millions of floating point operations per second". That is very important for some programs (such as ray-tracers), but less relevant for other programs, such as DTP. That's why benchmarks stink. For a DTP application, MIPS is more important, although I'd prefer to hear some Dhrystones and SpecMarks numbers as well. -- Ethan FF buckets of bits on the bus, FF buckets of bits. Take one down, Pass it to ground, FE buckets of bits on the bus. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 22:52:19 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!menudo.uh.edu!rc te2p@arizona.edu (Paul Stephen Sears) Subject: Atari-To-Amiga Convert Info Source! To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu peter@Sugar.NeoSoft.com (Peter da Silva) presents in article <1991Jun24.110408.29984@Sugar.NeoSoft.com> >In article scott@cs.odu.edu (Scott D. Yelich) writes: [misc stuff deleted] > >Amiga. I pushed the machine before I ever got one. I put off buying a >personal computer for 6 years waiting for something like the Amiga to >come out. There is still, 6 years later, *NO* other personal computer >with an operating system that satisfies my *minimum* functionality >requirements, unless you go out and buy a UNIX box. Isn't that great? A unix box that costs less that an Amiga 3000 and it even has ethernet built in.... Maybe you should have waited longer than 6 years to make your decision... > >And at that it's one of the cheapest machines out there. > >> MY atari does what I need it to do. > >You're satisfied, but have you used a real computer? Yep... Every day... I use computers that have more raw processing power than 100 Amigas running in parallel processing... > >I've been there. I borrowed an IBM clone for a while, then an Atari ST. It's >called shopping around. The productivity improvement from reliable, efficient, >and responsive multitasking is amazing. Sounds like you didn't look around too much. You can get a used Sun 3 with 4 Meg ram for under $1000... > >There really is a basic, fundamental difference between the Amiga and the rest. >Your arguments make good sense when comparing Ataris and Mac and IBMs, but >there *is* something better. Of course there is. Buy a NeXT. I can get a NeXT with a 100M HD, 2.88M floopy, a MUCH better user interface, built in sound digitizer, *nix OS (MACH) plus many other ammenities for less than a Amiga 3000.... So please, don't cop the attitude that Amiga is the best buy for the money. Wake up... Steve Jobbs strikes again... (and I could add 32bit color for $1500 more) And, the NeXT has a 68040, display postscipt and a 400dpi laser printer... (I have an Atari 520 and I would still buy one today... of course, I would get my NeXT too...) > >And *you* don't have to wait 6 years to find it, like I did. >-- >Peter da Silva. `-_-' . > 'U` "Have you hugged your wolf today?" P.S: Here at UH, the monochrome NeXT is $3K with student discount... * Paul Sears * Technology *** |"The greater an individual's power * The University of Houston *** | over others, the greater the evil that * RCTE2P@Jetson.uh.edu * * * | might possibly originate with him." * RCTE2P@menudo.uh.edu * * * | - PROPAGANDA, from A Secret Wish (CD) -- * Paul Sears * Technology *** |"The greater an individual's power * The University of Houston *** | over others, the greater the evil that * RCTE2P@Jetson.uh.edu * * * | might possibly originate with him." * RCTE2P@menudo.uh.edu * * * | - PROPAGANDA, from A Secret Wish (CD) ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jun 91 00:09:56 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!know!dae mon@arizona.edu (Thomas Hill) Subject: Atari-To-Amiga Convert Info Source! To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu I can't really debate the reasoning behind now moving this discussion to the comp.sys.amiga.advocacy SIG. The original message has grown into something that wasn't really it's original intent. I have been able to help close to twenty Atari users so far, so the message has served it's purpose. I read and listened to those Email replies whichdiscussed this in a civil manner (Most of the hostile messages were deleted before I finished reading them). For this reason I'll ask everybody who expects a reply to leave your message in the comp.sys.amiga.advocacy SIG. One final note: Please re-read the original message with an open mind and see what I mean about "growing into something". Tom ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Jun 91 19:04:20 CDT From: Mike Dorman Subject: Beginner's Guide to setting up GCC. To: Atari List >I want to install the gcc, g++ binaries on my atari but I am a bit >confused what programs I need. When I look at the gnustuff at a.a >I will find archives with names in it that cannot be used in a Atari >with TOS file system (to long, to many points in it) > >So could anyone tell me how to setup my system so I can use the gnustuff >and what files to download from a.a? >I have a 1040STf with TOS 1.0, 1 Mb and enough diskspace or >a Mega 4 with TOS 1.4 and enough diskspace > >I do not want to have the sources just the binaries > > >Harold van Aalderen (hvaalde@cs.vu.nl) How to set up GCC--a simple tutorial: 1) You need to get the appropriate packages from a.a.u.e. Right now, I am not sure just where these are-I've been using a port of GCC 1.39 from John R. Dunning, and it works well. You probably need to (if I remember right (I've looked at all the files, and Think I remeber what's in them)) get gasbin01.zoo (the assembler), gccbin01.zoo, (the driver, the compiler, the preprocessor), and the utlbin20.zoo (the utilities, of which, the most important are the linker and the librarian). If you want the source debugger, you should get gdbbin01.zoo (the dbgger). Then you need to get libolb68.zoo, and if you want gem, gembin17.zoo. Then you need to get the include files, includ68.zoo. I think this is all--it's close. Note: I have not used these files, but I think I trust Graham Higgins, and they should work. 2) Move them to your Atari. This will probably take several floppys, or several hours of downloads. 3) Get yourself several MB free--I would recommend the 4MB machine-- you won't be able to compile big programs in 1MB--GCC *loves* memory-- and unarc the files (or unzoo, as the case may be). I recommend you put all the binaries in a directory bin all the libraries and object files in a directory lib(that's all the .olb and .o files), and all the includes in inc 4) You need to set the env vars GCCEXEC ("g:incc-" <-notice the gcc- prefix, it's important), GCC_EXEC_PREFIX (same as GCCEXEC), GNULIB (the obvious, w/no backslash) and GNUINC (same as GNULIB). Then you need to set TEMP. This must have NO BACKSLASH. I assume you're using a shell, too. 5) Write you a program, and call gcc with: gcc -v -o wombat.ttp wombat.c -v means verbose. -O means optimize. -c means don't link. Check the manual for others. Enough for now, my fingers hurt. Be sure to post any questions. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- : Michael Alan Dorman : : : MDORMAN1@UA1VM.UA.EDU : Hobbies are things people do when they should be : : BIX: syssupport : sleeping. --M.A.D. : : GEnie: M.DORMAN2 : : : PostalNet: : : : Box 8068 : Stonehenge was built by two drunks with no : : Tuscaloosa, AL : witnesses. --P.S.McGhee : : 35486 : : ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jun 91 00:03:48 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!ccut!wnoc-tyo-news! toumon!wucc!ytsuji@arizona.edu (Y.Tsuji) Subject: Hard Disks To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article <1991Jun25.153957.25883@sae.com>, malay@sae.com (Bob Malay) writes: ------ A while ago I posted a plea for information concerning hard disk drives. I am in the market for one and I'm interested in what is being used out there. Whats good, bad? Why? For example, is the Supra any good? Is it slow/fast/noisy? Forget about that Amiga crap - I need some honest help here! Bob Malay ------ Frankly, I recommend everyone to buy ICD stuff, be it internal or external. The problem of hard drives is much of a software nature and I think most people agree that ICD's are the best. And then you can buy any of the SCSI drives in the market. Mine is Conner Peripherals' SCSI drive housed by a Japanese case and power supply, etc. and it is quieter than my MEGA ST. The speed? It is rather slow but 570 KB per second, which isn't too bad ( I understand 500+ KB per second things are generally regarded as fast). Cheers, Tsuji ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 20:34:05 GMT From: convex!rosenkra@uunet.uu.net (William Rosencranz) Subject: lharc woes To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article ue@nathan.ruhr.de writes: >Hi, >what about giving STZip a try? Ok, it's still called a beta version, but >it works, its faster than LHarc, and the compression rate is alomost the >same as LHarc's... >The actual version is 0.9beta... ONLY, repeat ONLY iff 1) there is full source for ST, Unix, VMS, and whatever, 2) ONLY (again) if there is only ONE, repeat, ONE version, fully controlled by ONE group (not 10+ like lharc), 3) ONLY if it is so much better than zoo (2.01 or 2.10 or the new, soon to be released version) that it is much faster (both compression and decompression), much easier to use (command line interface, arguably zoo's single weakness, with hooks to add it to arcgsh et al for those prefering GEM), much better compression, much more feature laden, but not so much as to get in the way, etc. please do NOT start posting archives in this format. i would propose a vote (here?), preceded by extensive testing (on ALL platforms) before this happens. and i am reluctant to use anything labeled "beta" for archival. beta s/w should be used by beta testers, NOT the entire community. [ note that my initial reaction, of course, was "SHEESH! ANOTHER ARCHIVER FORMAT TO DEAL WITH" but i calmed down... :-) ] -bill rosenkra@convex.com -- Bill Rosenkranz |UUCP: {uunet,texsun}!convex!c1yankee!rosenkra Convex Computer Corp. |ARPA: rosenkra%c1yankee@convex.com ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 20:43:40 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!convex!rosenkra@arizona.edu (William Rosencranz) Subject: lharc woes (AGAIN, was Is musedt.lzh corrupted?) To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article Vincent.Pomey@linn.fidonet.org (Vincent Pomey) writes: >You could try using STZip, it process zip files (compatible with PKZip on PC), >is faster than LHArc 1.13.19, compress roughly the same (better on big text >files, worse on very small files), and has a built-in GEM interface. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ why? does this mean it won't port to unix et al? if so, i recommend against it... -bill rosenkra@convex.com (defender of portability :-) -- Bill Rosenkranz |UUCP: {uunet,texsun}!convex!c1yankee!rosenkra Convex Computer Corp. |ARPA: rosenkra%c1yankee@convex.com ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jun 91 04:10:40 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!unix.cis.pitt.ed u!rjast1@arizona.edu (Robert J Anisko) Subject: monitor woes To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu was bright (florescent) orange instead of the white it should have been. To put it simply, the screen is royally screwd up (sorry for typos, using an Atari 8 Subject: Please, no Amiga "discussions" here To: I'd also like to go on record to request that no Amiga evangelism occur here. This service is not free for me and I'm not receiving any so-called enlightenment from these debates. Fellow STers, just don't respond to this idiot's "service" to our community. If he continues flooding my account with Amiga junk mail, I'm going to forward the messages to not only his account but also the Amiga address. It is so amazing to me that we STers need such help. Apparently the Amiga is so doggedly difficult to learn that the machine is incapable of being learned by such illiterate novices as STers. If anything, this Amiga evangelist has totally driven me away from the Amiga. Anthony F Gaudiano ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jun 91 03:35:01 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.w isc.edu!caen!umich!wsu-cs!jake!pbh@arizona.edu (Patrick Haggood) Subject: Problems with Ghostscript To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu I just downloaded ghostscript the other day and have loaded it into my E: drive under \ghostscr.ipt directory. In my cli (MT-C shell) I've set GS_LIB to both e:/ghostscr.ipt and e:\ghostscr.ipt in the profile. I try to print one of the example files as 'gs chess.ps' and get: reading ghost.ps (Printing in memory, please ..etc) ghost.ps read Cant find Fontmap! (copyleft info) GS<4> (and a prompt) What am I doing wrong? What's this fontmap it's looking for? -- Patrick B. Haggood Wayne STate University Detroit, MI Physics - Class of 1991 (-2?) ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 23:10:03 GMT From: noao!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!jato!vsnyder@arizona.edu (Van Snyder) Subject: ST and Multisync To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu In article larserio@ifi.uio.no writes: >Multisync monitor switchbox and cabel (this is tested and works) >"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" >If you want monochrome your monitor must handle 71 Hz frequency >NOT all monitors do this - To be sure - Test before you buy it! > > > Multisync side (no pin number - they depend on your monitor outlet) > > Red Green Blue HorSync VertSync Ground > | | | | | | > | | | | | | > SW1---SW2---SW3-------. | | |---SW4---. > | | | | | | | | > | | | | | | | | > Red Green Blue Monochrome HorSync VertSync Ground MonoDetect > 7 6 10 11 9 12 13 4 I did this with a NEC-2D and the monochrome image came out about 1/3 of a screen high. >Don't worry, the worst bit isn't making this - it's getting the >13-pin Atari monitor connector for the ST side and solder it !! I simply cut my Atari cable and soldered in a pair of DB-15's. They're really easy to find. When I got tired of switching monitors by changing DB-15 plugs, I built a switch using a 7-pole rotary, and some MORE DB-15's. The one I found in a surplus store for $US 3.95 had 5 positions, but I only used two. > Lars-Erik / ABK-BBS +47 2132659 / ____ ______ ________________________ > Osterud / larserio@ifi.uio.no / /___ / The norwegian ST >__________/ ______________________/ ____/ / Klubben, user association -- vsnyder@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov ames!elroy!jato!vsnyder vsnyder@jato.uucp ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 19:41:35 GMT From: math.fu-berlin.de!fauern!faui43.informatik.uni-erlangen.de!csbrod@uunet.uu.net (Claus Brod) Subject: Thomas Quester, where are you? To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu es2a+@andrew.cmu.edu (Eric Stuyvesant) writes: > I'm looking for a valid e-mail address for/to Herr Quester to send >him a bug report. The ones included in the documentation to lzh11321 >don't seem to work. Can anyone provide any suggestions? Sorry for the >waste of bandwidth. Try Thomas_Quester@hh.maus.de and lemme know if this works 8-) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Claus Brod, Am Felsenkeller 2, Things. Take. Time. D-8772 Marktheidenfeld, Germany (Piet Hein) csbrod@medusa.informatik.uni-erlangen.de Claus_Brod@wue.maus.de ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jun 91 01:25:40 GMT From: unisoft!bdt!bbs@uunet.uu.net Subject: Whoops! To: Info-Atari16@naucse.cse.nau.edu Hello... I was reading through some of the messages here and saw a phone number for the U.K. (44-344-485971) Thinking there was a modem at the other I called with my modem and got a person instead of a squeal. I wasn't able to apologize in voice so I hope you accept my apologies here in print for the disturbance. Regards, Jonnie Santos San Diego, California ------------------------------ End of Info-Atari16 Digest ******************************